West Point crybaby cries

| December 4, 2012 | 196 Comments

Let me preface this with an explanation. I have no religion, it’s been decades since I stepped through church doors, not because I don’t believe in God, but for different reasons entirely. I won’t discuss it because I don’t feel it’s an appropriate public discussion. So having said that, let’s look at this pencil dick moron, Blake Page, who has resigned from West Point because he thinks that his right to not have a traditional religion is being infringed upon at the US Military Academy. Of course, when he resigned, he had to explain it on Huffington Post because anyone who disagrees with the majority of the country feels a need to make a spectacle of themselves in public to prove how independent they are.

While there are certainly numerous problems with the developmental program at West Point and all service academies, the tipping point of my decision to resign was the realization that countless officers here and throughout the military are guilty of blatantly violating the oaths they swore to defend the Constitution. These men and women are criminals, complicit in light of day defiance of the Uniform Code of Military Justice through unconstitutional proselytism, discrimination against the non-religious and establishing formal policies to reward, encourage and even at times require sectarian religious participation. These transgressions are nearly always committed in the name of fundamentalist evangelical Christianity.

Two decades in the military, all of it with “No Pref” stamped on my dog tags, and I never had anyone preach to me about my lack of religion. There was a pretty young blonde girl in Hinesville, GA who tried to convert me once, but she wasn’t part of the military, and it didn’t take.

In fact, as I think back on my career, I don’t think I ever knew what the religious persuasion was of any of my leaders. I remember I had a Baptist minister as one of my squad leaders in my first platoon at Fort Hood, but he never tried to influence me or any of his subordinates.

And, oh, Page is completely wrong on the Constitution;

Many here are regularly told they do not deserve a place in the military. They are shown through policy that the Constitution guarantees their freedom of, but not from religion. Many are publically [sic] chastised for seeking out a community of likeminded [sic] people because it is such a common belief that Humanism and other non-religious philosophies are inherently immoral and worse.

The First Amendment says “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof….” I don’t see Congress making a law respecting religion, at West Point or anywhere else, so obviously, smartypants here doesn’t know what the Constitution says. That’s probably another reason that its good that he resigned from the academy.

As the President of the West Point Secular Student Alliance (SSA), a Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers (MAAF) affiliate, and first Director of Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF) Affairs at West Point….

It sounds to me as if he’s a fanatic about his religion, or rather, the lack thereof, and I’m sure he’s probably done a fair amount of proselytizing himself about his personal superiority over Christians. That Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers shit gets me…like they are the only freethinkers on the planet just because they don’t want to be judged in this life by God. By the way, philosophies aren’t immoral, people are immoral.

I’m thankful that Page resigned from the Army, he wasn’t going to be a good leader, anyway, because he’s way too sensitive about his personal choices and I doubt he could keep his opinions out of the platoon CP. his single-minded adherence to all of those organizations instead of focusing on his studies and becoming a good leader would have had consequences under fire. I mean the dude can’t even read the Constitution. So the Army has dodged a bullet on this one.

Category: Military issues, Shitbags

Loading Facebook Comments ...

Comments (196)

Trackback URL | Comments RSS Feed

  1. melle1228 says:

    @ Joe,

    Stop taking a few isolated incidents and projecting them on “todays” military. I am just a wife, but my husband assures me that he never gave Bibles to Afganis and was told he was in a holy war by Generals. The military goes OVERBOARD to be inclusive..

  2. Joe says:

    And Twist, with all due respect, just ‘cuz you haven’t seen it doen’t mean it doesn’t happen. I have read more accounts of all that kinda stuff, from active soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, than I can remember. Either they are all making stuff up, or you are not omniscient.

  3. You Aint Grunt You Aint Shit says:

    Really Redacted, because I hear a lot of Christians saying the same things you claim to hear Atheists saying, so maybe such delusions aren’t something exclusive to just one group, even if one group as a whole tends to be more delusional.

    Twist, if your kid had a Muslim teacher who wanted to lead class in prayer five times daily, would you be okay with that?

  4. BohicaTwentyTwo says:

    Oh good grief. Well, I hope he enjoys his time as a non-promotable E-4. Seems all bent out of shape just because he couldn’t get anyone to give him a cookie on Sunday morning. I still remember during Beast marching off to the Catholic chapel singing a cadence as loud as we could, “We are Fish Eaters, and we like to eat fish.” Sorry this guy had to go back to his barracks room and polish his boots, or whatever they do theses days.

  5. melle1228 says:

    @ 52 C’mon Joe, I have also read that the miltiary are baby killing psychopaths– doesn’t mean it is true or even remotely indicative of all military personnel.

    @53 In case you weren’t aware, California school’s already make students become Muslim for a 6 week sensitivity program.

  6. Joe says:

    Then I guess the thousands of servicemen and women who have contacted MRFF about unwanted religious pressure (and worse) from peers and superiors are delusional or smoking crack……

  7. Common Sense says:

    My family is not religious. You can call us “atheist with a small a”. We celebrate Christmas and Easter as family holidays, i.e. we don’t think we’ll melt like the Wicked Witch if we see a cross or nativity. We proudly recite the Pledge of Allegiance and acknowledge the Judeo/Christian heritage of our country.

    My son had fun with the religion thing in AF BMT. They could choose from a dozen different services. If they chose not to attend a service, they could stay behind and clean the dorms. Needless to say, my son chose to go to a service. He tried a different one every week and preferred Wicca because they got cookies and punch and could sleep (meditate) during the service. He did find it strange and humorous when a colonel (male) stood up and said “I am a witch”. Apparently, everyone is a witch, there are no warlocks. I don’t really want to offend any witches out there, but we’re not the PC family and found the mental picture hilarious.

    I asked him if any of them changed his mind and he said “hell no”.

    Frankly, our approach to religion sure beats the one we’re fighting that likes to chop people’s head off or stone women to death. If the guy at West Point can’t handle the religious stuff at the Academy, then he sure can’t handle what’s dealt out in real life.

  8. Common Sense says:

    Forgot to add that at no time was my son ever pressured to select any one religion or any religion at all.

  9. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    @ 39 Infantry Aye!

  10. melle1228 says:

    >Then I guess the thousands of servicemen and women who have contacted MRFF about unwanted religious pressure (and worse) from peers and superiors are delusional or smoking crack……

    Or they could be just overly sensitive crybabies who have grown up in this “don’t offend me” PC culture.

    I am very much like Jonn with religion and so is my husband. Neither of us have had any pressure in the 21 years he has served. Have we been preached too- sure, but no more than we hear from our atheists friends). Frickin learn to gently or not so gently tell people you disagree with them..Done!

  11. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    This is a good conversation … the onion is pealed back. I know what is in the middle!

  12. DaveO says:

    A little history that our Founding Fathers were intimately knowledgeable of:

    Henry VIII, in protest created the Church of England – the Roman Catholic Church, once the Official Church, was displaced. Henry killed off hordes of Catholics under the guise of loyalty to one, state-established church.

    His daughter, Queen Mary, a Roman Catholic, tried to reverse that and slaughtered many protestants. Bloody Mary was one hell of a Queen.

    Queen Elizabeth reversed the pro-Catholicism and slaughtered Catholics within and outside of England.

    The Roundheads and the Cavaliers made a go of it as well.

    The Puritans were a reformist movement that were surpressed under Elizabeth, James, and subsequent monarchs. They ended up in Plymouth.

    The Catholics, with Lord Baltimore as their patron, founded Maryland.

    Our Founding Fathers were intimately aware that a state-established church lead to much bloodshed between and among families, generations, and nations. The first amendment offered by George Mason and James Madison of Virginia addressed this by saying the US of A won’t recognise any one church over another – but that all are equal in this country.

    That permitted the many varieties of Christians and Jews in America to live in peace unknown in the rest of the world. Or is this too much factual context?

  13. Common Sense says:

    Another thought… a big part of the Air Force creed is “service before self”.

    “Integrity First, Service Before Self, Excellence In All We Do”

    I think a lot of these whiners forget that part. Service is more important than your personal religion, gender, sex partner preference, and even your life. To serve mean to sacrifice and sometimes that means putting up with stuff you normally wouldn’t in the civilian world (perhaps a lot of the time).

    I fear we’re raising a generation of thin-skinned people who only think of themselves. If they don’t like the rules, environment, commitment, etc. then they shouldn’t join.

  14. Jonn Lilyea says:

    Yeah, Joe, I’m too old and out of touch. Well, except for the fact that my son is currently in the Air Force.And the thousands of readers who I hear from every day who are still serving.

    And, yes, since you’re unable to recognize when you’re being baited, I believe Godless heathens lie.

  15. Ex-PH2 says:

    I like this viewpoint:

    “It is rigidity that is the problem, it is rigidity that is the problem in any walk of life. There is nothing wrong, for example, with religion in itself, it is the rigidity you often find that is the problem, the sense that things have to be one way and one way only.”

    Says it all for me.

  16. melle1228 says:

    @65

    No, a bunch of buzy bodies looking for job justification..

  17. Debbie says:

    ahahaha! As a bred ‘n born USAF Brat with 23 plus years as a dependent, I had to ask a Protestant Chaplain what “being saved” meant. I’m sure there’s someone more deserving to fill those shoes in the mighty fine institution of Westpoint.

  18. Joe says:

    Ex-PH2,
    So is the constitution “overly rigid” in mandating the seperation, the complete seperation, of church and state (and yes, it does mandate that)?

  19. CI says:

    I have little compassion for someone who makes a solemn promise to serve his nation, then backs out when he isn’t making the grade, only to use someone else’s religion as the crutch.

    I’ve seen proselytizing during my career, and comments by LTG Boykin and other events aren’t fiction….but shouldn’t be treated as the norm, nor an excuse to escape from one’s promise.

    I have the utmost toleration of anyone’s religion, as long as they don’t attempt to legislate by it where there is no secular value, and they don’t get pissy when a store says Holidays instead of Christmas.

  20. melle1228 says:

    @69–>>

    The Constitution NEVER mandated the seperation of Church and State. In fact, the early colonies and states had state churches, and it was the founders that wrote those state constitutions. Sep of Church and State besides being in a Jefferson letter(which was to assure the Church that is was protected from the state) was an interpretation based on a letter NOT the Constitution in a SCOTUS decision. And certainly the founders NEVER wanted religion completely removed from the public square-. I wish people would actually look at history instead of spouting platitudes and talking points. I cannot believe atheists who are all atwitter because someone somewhere beliefs in God.

    And as an agnostic, I would rather be stuck with frickin Christians than socialists or Muslims.

  21. Old Trooper says:

    @69: Once you realize that when you sign up for the military, you lose some of your Constitutional rights, because you fall under the UCMJ, then you can’t really use the Constitution as your go to document. Granted, no matter how many times we tell civilians like you, Joe, ya just don’t seem to get it. It seems that the same ones that want to fall back on the Constitution as a rigid document when it comes to the 1st Amendment seem to lose that same zeal when it comes to the 2nd Amendment; I wonder why?

  22. 2-17 Air Cav says:

    It must really tick off sissy boy to hear every president say, “God bless you and God bless the United States of America.” Then there’s that money thing. He can avoid the speeches but not the coin. “In God We Trust.” Then there’s the “Christmas” tree lighting ceremony. That’s tonight, I think. What else? There’s the 10 Commandments on the doors of the US Supreme Court. There’s Congress and its opening prayer. What am I missing?

  23. melle1228 says:

    @ 73

    There is a certain group of atheist who are like Grinches and babies.. Because they have no religion(and I use the term loosely since I believe atheism is a form of belief)- no one else should have religion..

    I am sure this guy told anybody who wished to know(and some that didn’t) that he didn’t believe in the “flying spaghetti monster” or “sky fairies.” But ya know that isn’t prostelytizing..

  24. Ex-PH2 says:

    @Joe – Here’s the First Amendment for you. Read it and tell me where it is a mandate.

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    Looks like free choice to me in matters of spirituality, up to the individual, that sort of thing.

    The paragraph that I quoted says rigidity is a problem in many things, as, for example, in religion: “it is the rigidity you often find that is the problem (in religion), the sense that things have to be one way and one way only.”

    Where in the world do you see the first amendment to the US Constitution expressing rigidity in spiritual matters? Or even specifying anything other than individual choice? Where?

    Well, it isn’t there, so your argument that there is a mandate about separation of church and state in the Constitution, when there is no such mandate, doesn’t make any sense.

  25. 2-17 Air Cav says:

    The problem here is what the Constitution says in its plain language and how various Supreme Courts have construed (and misconstrued) it from time to time. That’s the rub.

  26. AverageNCO says:

    @74
    You said it! I find hardcore atheists and hardcore religion followers to be two sides of the same coin. I also find them to be equally annoying. During my military career I’ve met lots of “people-of-faith” and just as many “people-of-non-faith & no-specific faith”. The vast majority co-exist to accomplish the mission at hand. You’ll find that people who tend to inisist they are 100% right all the time on matters of faith/non-faith, also tend to just as hard to work with on other mundane matters.

  27. Ex-PH2 says:

    @76, yes, and I was trying to make a point that was apparently understood by almost everyone. Trying to stir up a disupte over something that is plainly expressed is a waste of time and energy.

  28. Ex-PH2 says:

    That should be “dispute”, not “disupte”.

  29. Ex-PH2 says:

    And, frankly, I saw aggressive recruiting by religious fundamentalists on campus in the 1970s, when I was in college, while I never saw anything in the Navy. The chaplain was there if you wanted to attend services or had some issue to discuss. That was about it.

  30. Twist says:

    @53, Yet you answered none of my questions because you can’t.

    I will do something that you refuse to do. If a teacher wanted to have my child participate in Muslim prayers I would tell them no, my child does not believe that way, but I would not try to keep everyone that believes that way from following their beliefs like you seem want to do.

  31. Redacted1775 says:

    Yes, #53, really.

  32. Sgt Awesome says:

    So, this kid expresses his opinion and your first reaction is to attack and insult him and you really wonder why he is doing what he is doing? All you fucking idiots complaining about the “evil” atheists and their preaching are completely blind to the fucking irony of your words. Alas, I’d rather stick a cactus up my ass than have a religious conversation in an internet comments section so enjoy.
    /out

  33. Jonn Lilyea says:

    I don’t know, Sgt Awesome, this looks more like a philosophy discussion than a religion discussion. And it looks like many of the people calling him names are atheists themselves.

  34. Redacted1775 says:

    Who called atheists evil? I have no opinion of them either way, except the weaklings that are offended by everyone that doesn’t believe as they do. They’re pure douche buckets.

  35. Twist says:

    @Joe, I never said I was omniscient, that is why I made sure that I said “from what I saw”. I would like to see some links to what you say is happening.

  36. Anonymous says:

    @83 in the 82 previous comments I fail to see a single comment where atheists are called evil. Nor see anyone attacking “the kid” (I assume you mean Joe) for his opinion or classification as an atheist. What I do see is folks taking issue with his contention that the military is cramming religion down service members throats en masse.

    Additionally, I see you interjecting yourself into the convo with completely off base allegations. You clearly agree with Joe. Good for you. But get off your high horse and dont act like because some people here disagree with you that you are being attacked.

    And also oh “awesome” one, type E5, one each; next time why don’t you try acting like a grown up and refrain from name calling and profanity. People have different opinions. Everyone seems to be ok with that but you.

  37. CI says:

    @85 – Well said. It doesn’t matter if it’s religion or lack of religion…..if it’s not inhibiting your life, liberty or pursuit of happiness…pull up your big boy pants and mind your self.

  38. martinjmpr says:

    In 23+ years of service I never saw any of the prosletyzing that Joe speaks of. Not saying it didn’t happen in a few rare instances but there’s a big difference between what one GI might say to his buddies and what a commander uses his power under the UCMJ to do. I not only never saw anybody pressured to attend religious services, I never knew anybody who claimed that it had happened to them. So, to the extent that it happens, it’s pretty damn rare and in no way reflects any official or unofficial policy of any military unit.

  39. 2-17 Air Cav says:

    @83. Given your approach, I’d rather see you stick a cactus up your ass too.

  40. melle1228 says:

    @ 83 Why are you so overly sensitive?

  41. 2-17 Air Cav says:

    @91. How sensitive can he be if he prefers a cactus rectal catheter to a conversation? He took his ball and went home. Also, if you want him back, you have to use radio lingo.

  42. DaveO says:

    From whiney West Pointers to a cactus rectal exam. Who said there’s no humor in Obamacare?

  43. malclave says:

    @65

    Joe, I took a look at your link. The very first item claimed that it was unconstitutional for a religious group to distribute a religious-themed video game to members of the military.

    I didn’t really need to read past that. Your group is a bunch of hacks.

  44. O-4E says:

    I am assuming this kid quit after the first 2 years right before his junior year.

    If so that was 2 years of US taxpayer funded education at an Ivy League level institution to the tune of about $100,000 per year…

    So the US taxpayer is out at least $200K and the Army is out a new LT in the future because this a$$hat took up a seat that could have been filled by someone else

    And this guy walks away owing nothing

    The Army spent less than $10K to make me a 2nd LT from a Staff Sergeant…and I am still here after 23 years of service

    Funny no one mentions this fact

  45. Hondo says:

    O-4E: basic article Jonn cites indicates the tool was 5 months from graduation – e.g. would have graduated next year. That means he owes Uncle Same some time as an enlisted soldier unless the Army releases him from that obligation.

    Things could have changed, but if memory serves me correctly a USMA Cadet who resigns during but before completing his/her 4th year of studies owes 3 years enlisted service. It’s a fairly rare occurrence but it does happen on occasion.

  46. Ex-PH2 says:

    @96 Hondo, yes it does occasionally happen. I worked with a guy who left Annapolis and finished his term of service as an E-5. He left because he had no college prep for the math level, which in the 1960s was very high. I don’t know what it is now, but it was very tough at the time. He was a nice guy, too.

    This tapeworm admits in his blog post on HufPo that he owes the US taxpaers a considerable sum, and acknowledges that he’ll have to put in XXX years of enlisted service, but for the rest of the article, he whines about his decision being entirely the fault of the other cadets.

    Look at his picture. Then look at his name. He’s a squirmy little worm, a whiny little boy. Blake? Blake Page? Who names their kid Blake? or Blaine? There’s a bigger photo of BLAKE attached to this link:

    http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/04/15676692-west-point-cadet-quits-cites-criminal-behavior-of-officers?lite&gt1=43001

    He’s a boring, whiny little snot and he’ll probably try to find some way out of his service contract and paying back all that money. I’m sure he’ll pop up again, so he’s on my list.

  47. NHSparky says:

    Joe–take a hint from the people who were there, including me. No religion shoved down anyone’s throat. Religious belief (or lack thereof) did not hinder anyone’s progress through the ranks.

    Being a whiny douchenozzle might have, but not their take on God.

  48. Hondo says:

    Found the governing Army reg. Current policies don’t appear to have changed and are in table 3 of

    http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r612_205.pdf

    Summary:
    (1) if the indiv is separated for unsuitability or disability, they get discharged.
    (2) if the indiv entered from enlisted status (some cadets do) and had 6+ mo service obligation remaining at time of resignation/separation, they return to enlisted status; with <6 mo active duty obligation they are discharged.
    (3) if the indiv entered from civilian status and quits before starting the 3rd academic year, they are discharged.
    (4) if the indiv entered from civilian status and quits/is separated after starting the 3rd academic year but before starting the 4th academic year, they get get transferred to the USAR and ordered to active duty at the grade of PFC for a period of 2 years.
    (5) if the indiv entered from civilian status and the quits/is separated after starting the 4th academic year but before graduating, they get transferred to the USAR and ordered to active duty at the grade of SPC for a period of not less than 2 and not more than 3 years.
    (6) if the indiv entered from civilian status, graduates, and refuses to accept a commission, they get get transferred to the USAR and ordered to active duty at the grade of SPC for 4 years.

    All of those are subject to modification by DA as DA sees fit, including the enlisted grade at which the individual is ordered to serve on active duty.

  49. Joe says:

    Some of you guys are funny. What the hell does the name his parents gave him have to do with anything? Anyway, here’s his perspective, a little different from yours, and he was at West Point, and I don’t mean back in the Jurrasic era:

    “Countless officers here and throughout the military are guilty of blatantly violating the oaths they swore to defend the Constitution,” wrote Page, who was slated to graduate in May. “These men and women are criminals, complicit in light of day defiance of the Uniform Code of Military Justice through unconstitutional proselytism, discrimination against the non-religious and establishing formal policies to reward, encourage and even at times require sectarian religious participation.”

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *