That whole Dorner thing

| February 14, 2013

So, Crispy Dorner has apparently checked out from the human race, just like he wanted. I woke up this morning and the birds were still singing and the coffeepot started at it’s programmed time – so everything is back to normal – well except those nattering nabobs on what we used to call “the news” who are still thinking that Dorner is news to someone. A guest on CNN even told the audience of mush-headed morons that he thought the whole story was exciting like some movie I’ll never watch.

The whole Dorner episode wouldn’t have been news except the LAPD seems to be run by a bunch of drama queens – which is what you’d expect in Hollywood’s bedroom community. They are the same folks who occupied way too many column inches a scant few weeks ago because they had removed a “rocket propelled grenade launcher” from the street of LA with their buy back program. What they had actually removed was an empty, useless and harmless fiberglass tube from the streets. But, to me that gives us an insight into the department’s psyche. For most of the life of the story, the only pictures of Dorner we saw were those of him in a camouflaged Navy uniform, even though it had been years since he was supposed to be wearing that uniform, judging by his military records.

Nothing Dorner did in those days of the “manhunt” was at all related to his military service, yet we saw him in that military uniform several times a day. Yeah, he ambushed two cops and killed one – but it was nothing that hasn’t happened thousands of times across the country perpetrated by thugs with no military training. Dorner was a washout in the military – the media made a big deal out of his “markmanship ribbon” from the Navy. I don’t know what the Navy requirements are for the award of that ribbon, but in the Army, you were a marksman if you hit your target 24 out of 40 times – that’s not especially good. All of his awards in the Navy were awards that everyone got for showing up. He got out of the Navy because he couldn’t get promoted to O-4 (whatever that rank is in the Navy) which means that he had scraped by to make O-3 and the Navy was tired of him.

So, why the LAPD hired him, I have no idea, nor will I speculate. He was large and imposing, and I get the idea from watching LAPD over the last few weeks, appearances are all that’s important.

Then there’s the big spectacular “firefight” to finally bring Dorner to justice. If you haven’t seen the video, here it is from the Washington Post;

If those cops had been my privates, I’d have been kicking their asses – that “standoff” was more of a “standing around”. The only time I saw anyone duck was when their own guys were shooting in the opposite direction. And I love the part where one cop sneaks up behind another a cop and pokes him with the barrel of his weapon in the back.

Apparently, from what I’ve read, Dorner had left his one long gun in the stolen car when he abandoned it and had only handguns in the cabin and whatever ammunition he could carry – probably not that much. But, it looked to me like there were too many cops on the fringe of the battle who just came up to the firefight and lobbed a few rounds in the general direction and then promptly retreated. I guess they were just hoping that someone would set the place on fire so they wouldn’t have to come out from behind the endless lines of vehicles.

Don’t get me wrong – I think the police are important and I’m glad that the casualties were relatively few, but if this is what we can expect from a post-9-11 police force, I think we’re in trouble. I understand that a firefight is different from training, and the plan tends to fall apart when the first round is fired – but Dorner wasn’t the highly trained killer that they made him out to be. If they ever come up against one private who paid attention through his infantry training, those cops are going to be in the hurt locker.

And if the police put the time and effort into the training they need to have in this situation, it would have given them the confidence to stop those two newspaper delivery ladies instead of blasting at them right off.

Dorner was a scumbag piece of shit, but the military didn’t make him that way. Like I told the Huffington Post, he got a rope wrapped up in a propeller when he tried to steal a boat and escape – I’m pretty sure they cover boats and ropes on the first day in the Navy. And he was trying to hide from the police when he set his SUV on fire, like that wouldn’t tell them where he was. Who heads for snow country in the winter to hide out from police when there are miles of desert nearby?

The LAPD’s performance during this was embarrassing, but they have time to correct that so that it doesn’t happen next time…and it will happen again. With CNN guests making Dorner the next Robin Hood, it’s inevitable. The LAPD should stop clapping itself on the back and get to work with real training.

And to all of those of you out there who want to make Dorner some sort of superhero – superheroes don’t ambush their adversaries at a stop sign and shoot unarmed people in their home because he lost his job. He was a crackpot and the Navy divested themselves of him for the same reasons that the LAPD should have done the same thing.

Category: Crime

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  1. That whole Dorner thing « DPGI | February 14, 2013
  1. Loach says:

    California is a big place. LAPD does not cover it all. The first cops ambushed were from Riverside. The ending incident happened with San Bernadino County Sheriffs. As you point out with other things, accuracy is important.

  2. Rock8 says:

    FWIW, most of the LE in this video are San Bernardino County Deputy Sheriffs.

  3. NHSparky says:

    I don’t know what the Navy requirements are for the award of that ribbon, but in the Army, you were a marksman if you hit your target 24 out of 40 times – that’s not especially good.

    To qualify M-16, we had to hit 20 out of 30 silhouettes at a range of 100 meters, IIRC. Yeah, not that freakin hard. That’s different than the medal shoot, where we did a 1000-inch target prone, sitting, standing, both timed and not. 30 rounds total, possible 300 points, and IIRC, it was 240 for marksman, 260 for sharpshooter, 270 for expert. Again, not too terribly difficult.

    And looking at that video, it looks like the cops have some shiny new bang sticks, but the cops there (who all share resources, etc) haven’t learned jack shit since the North Hollywood shootout (has it been almost 15 years already?) I’m no infantryman but even I’m not that impressed.

  4. CavScoutCoastie says:

    Without commenting specifically on this situation, I’ll make one point. I was part of a response to a nut with a gun this past weekend. He was holed up in his house. Our basic response is to evacuate the immediate neighbors and isolate the area from pedestrian and foot traffic. So far so good. At the individual tactical level, I thought it was a bit of a mess and my agency is a pretty good one. One reason though is that we responded at a moment’s notice from all over the zone. Initially there were 6 of us (grew to over 2 dozen cars) who hadn’t really worked or trained together. There was a mix of weapons; some had shotguns, some carbines, some just pistols. In other words, we’re not a small unit that has worked and trained together. I’m a reserve so I really don’t know many of these people and they don’t know me. In this beautifully manicured neighborhood, cover and concealment were tough to come by as well. We had to improvise alot. Of course too, it doesn’t help that we’re actually trying NOT to hurt the nut.
    My point is that, tactically, the cops won’t equal an infantry squad. The initial response is always going to ad hoc, depending on who is on duty, where in the zone they are coming from, etc… As I said, I think my agency is pretty good and I didn’t see any egregious safety problems but the nature of the job means we’ll never get to same small unit tactical level as military units.
    As for LAPD in this incident, I just can’t comment without knowing more about what was going on. I agree it doesn’t look good. I just wanted to make the point though about police response being very fluid and improvisational.

  5. Harrison says:

    Good to know that it’s cool for the cops to just burn people alive instead of according them the common courtesy of one between the eyes, something we figured even UBL rated.

    Granted, I absolutely think he deserved it, but that’s not my decision to make and it’s sure as hell not for the cops to decide, either.

    All this clusterfuck needed was Lon Horiuchi taking potshots at women and children and we’d have had another Waco. At least we would, if Dorner were white; I guess as far as conservatives are concerned he’s just another dead racist and offensive term for Black person deleted.

  6. 2/17 Air Cav says:

    I was impressed with what I saw in the footage. There were some really nice pickups and SUVs in the video.

  7. Fen says:

    @5 Harrison – why do you need to turn this into a racial issue? Penance for all the horrible things you’ve done to blacks?

  8. NHSparky says:

    Uh, Harrison–jam your race-baiting bullshit up your ass sideways, please.

    Pretty please, with a fucking cherry on top.

  9. Twist says:

    Troll Will Robinson Troll…..waves arms around.

  10. PintoNag says:

    @5 You did NOT just throw the race card at us!? Show me one post — just ONE — where anybody on here said ANYTHING about Dorner’s race.

  11. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    Harrison … not a good choice of words. Further, quite tasteless and most certainly racist in tone!

  12. Bill R. says:

    Like your article, our local sports radio DJ was talking about his military training. I called and straightened them out telling them he was just a Navy cop and the average infantryman had more skills than Dorner did. None of them ever served so they were clueless.
    Also, Harrison, you’re a freakin’ idiot. In 2013, few people, other than race baiters like yourself, give a flying f**k what color anyone’s skin is.

  13. Steve says:

    Yea, I was trying to be San Bernardino Sheriff, but was unable to attend the Physical Test because my wife went into labor, but after watching their “Tactics” and seeing guys with the most ate up gear running around popping off a round or two in a general direction was sad. I’m sure they have to have a few SF guys, SEALS, Rangers, or hell a few infantryman that could have maneuvered on this guy. At least something better then :lets throw a few rounds where we think he is”

    On a side note, Cops do not get much training on the long gun. My father is a cop and him and I were shooting…well I was shooting he was just yanking down on the trigger. It took me 2 min to tell him what to do and he was plinking targets like you would expect a cop be able to.

    But yea, Dorner complete failure at everything he did, reading about his past any first year Psych major can tell you that. Blamaed everyone else for his short comings, and nothing was ever his fault. Obsessed with race, but I blame that on the media. To reiterate, what Navy man gets a propeller caught in some tie down rope? Thank god hes gone, but god forbid someone remotely trained does something similar…we may need those drones I hear so much about.

  14. USMCE8Ret says:

    Harrison, you fucking idiot. Dorner’s situation was nothing like Ruby Ridge or Waco, but I have a feeling you’d rather it was.

  15. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    @ 12 ….

    You say: “he was just a Navy cop”

    I say: “he was NOT a Navy cop”

    He was a low performing unrestricted line officer, who amounted to a big fat nothing while he bounced around from unit to unit pissing everyone off in the course of his existance. I have first hand info on this guy … he was NOTHING in my Navy!

    He was NOT A NAVY COP.

  16. Veritas Omnia Vincit says:

    Dorner is a murderous thug no doubt, that some in LA have sympathy for him is not necessarily indicative of an approval of Dorner (or promotion to superhero status) but more a response to a lack of sympathy and respect for a corrupt and oppressive police force that many in LA view with a perhaps well justified suspicion.

  17. Cacti35 says:

    @13 Steve, you’re correct, training costs dollars, when budgets get cut, training is the first thing to go. A lot of admin does not think that tactical and rifle training is a priority. I sent my tactical response team to train at Yakima Army Firing center where they have live shoot buildings. The tactical team went but not every deputy got to go because of the distance and cost. I agree with what Jonn wrote, when my wife and I were watching this thing unfold I pointed out to her all of the deputies standing in the open with no cover. There was a lot of big trees around there that I would have used. I too got sick of seein the bastard wearing a Navy uniform. As far as the fire, shit happens with tear gas canisters. The FBI burnt out a bunch of bank robbers back in the 80’s that were anti-government and mean mofos. The option given to these turds is to surrender. It is their choice to make.

  18. NHSparky says:

    VOV–LAPD and many surrounding jurisdiction’s police departments have, over the years, developed a “us-versus-them” mentality, partially out of self-preservation.

    Problem is, when you paint “everyone else” as the enemy, that’s usually just what they become.

  19. Ol' Tanker says:

    As a retired LEO and Army Officer I find the comments in the blog to be a bit disingenuous. It’s is hardly fair to try and compare the actions of the Sheriff deputies responding to a situation that they are not trained to work as to a trained infantry squad who’s job is to kill people. I especially find the idea that they are being criticised for the way it turned out to be silly in the extreme.

    Had that been an infantry squad there yeah they probably would have had better individual placement. Given that an infantry squad is also trained to gain fire superiority and expenditure of ammo is better than expending infantrymen the comments about the LEO’s popping off shots is hardly warranted. I imagine they would have employed a couple squad automatic weapons and would not give a damn if they shot the exact room the bad guy is in or not. as long as incoming fire to them was diminished. The infantry squad would also be equiped with grenade launchers and heavier weapons to bring to bear. It is easy to consider using a 50 cal or an anti tank rocket as a breaching method. I would find it rather hard to believe that the infantry squad would be all upset if the structure caught fire as a result of that. They certainly wouldn’t run inside the structure to secure the guy shooting them if that happened. It is also possible that they would have called in heavier firepower such as a rocket attack from an Apache if they had the option. Not real conducive to taking the guy alive and that little bit isn’t a real priority for an infantry squad either.

    As to letting the house burn, I have news for you. The Fire Department is not in the business of fighting a fire UNDER fire and are perfectly happy to let the structure burn to the point where they can fight the flames alone. I have seen them refuse to render aid to a fallen Officer because there was a risk of being exposed. They expected the Officer be brought to them instead of getting in the possible line of fire. Being shot at is not in their job description and I really don’t fault them for that. I didn’t like it but I do understand it.

    Lastly who caused the issue here? Was it the Sheriff Deputies, LAPD, Game Wardens or would it possibly be the guy who killed 3 people, threatened the families as well as other LEO’s and then killed another Deputy when they approached the house he broke into?

    I’ve seen PD’s criticised for being militarized and training in “military tactics using military equipment and weapons”. The n here we have a situation where they never got the chance to practice like that and folks who were not there, didn’t do anything to help, monday morning quarterback their performance using just what they had to do a job that had no good possible outcome. If the guy you want is determined to fight to the death and kill as many of you as he can, why should you let him do so? I recall being trained in the military that if you are fighting fair you are fighting stupidly. That asswipe is dead. He killed too many people as it is.

  20. PavePusher says:

    One of the news reports (CNN?) last night said that the two deputies shot Tes/Wed were hit by “a .50 caliber sniper rifle”…?

    Anyone got any info on that?

  21. Fen says:

    “As far as the fire, shit happens with tear gas canisters.”

    I gotta ask: did they use the flechette(?) rounds to deliver tear gas? Because it appears SOP is to launch tear gas and then act all surprised that the place burns to the ground.

  22. NHSparky says:

    I’d love to know how, considering how dense the woods are in that area. No friggin need for a .50 cal.

  23. Veritas Omnia Vincit says:

    Sparky, I have no sympathy for Dorner burning him out was very much a good option in my thinking. I hope he is spit roasted by the devil for all eternity.

    I also believe that the morons tweeting about killing cops were far beyond the pale in their comments.

    Having said that, I agree with you about the mentality. I think the reputation of the LAPD for many under its jurisdiction is one that equates the LAPD with the worst kind of oppressive, corrupt criminal organizations. Several prominent cases have cemented that view for many citizens in the LA. To get past that requires some heavy lifting. As with so many things that require heavy lifting I expect little positive outcome in the future, instead a series of band-aids applied to create a facade are more likely to be the outcome. Something to point at and say, “see they did do something”, but it will not address any systemic issues.

    Perhaps as I age I am becoming more cynical. I don’t necessarily believe that any of this gets fixed anymore. I tend to think it only gets worse as our society continues to fragment. A lot of people like to talk about how we are all Americans, but it appears instead of being a large melting pot we have become an ever more fragmented society as we attempt to accommodate everyone’s individual cultures instead of creating a larger unified culture that draws from the best in all of us rather than the least in all of us.

    Or perhaps I just haven’t had enough sugar or caffeine this morning.

  24. PavePusher says:

    Argh… “Tes” = Tues

  25. Fen says:

    “I find the comments in the blog to be a bit disingenuous. It’s is hardly fair to try and compare the actions of the Sheriff deputies responding to a situation that they are not trained to work as to a trained infantry squad who’s job is to kill people”

    Disagree. I have a reasonable expectation that Police Officers should be able to handle their weapon safely and with proficiency. Witness the 40+ rounds they sprayed at the two poor women in the truck. I’m happy their aim was off, but 40+ rounds at approx 30 yards and you don’t kill your target?

    And there are other indicators of unprofessional amateurism. Like poking your buddy in the back with your barrel (hello, BASIC firearm safety training) and meandering around out in the open.

  26. PintoNag says:

    Clearly, police work isn’t Mayberry RFD anymore, if it ever really was. As hard as we’ve come down on this department for the mistakes they’ve made, I wouldn’t have wanted the responsibilty they had to bring this situation to a conclusion. It couldn’t be anything but all kinds of ugly.

  27. Hondo says:

    Harrison: I edited your asinine comment above to remove the racial epithet. That’s something Jonn doesn’t usually tolerate here (he can chew my ass if I overstepped my limits here). If you’re trying to get banned or moderated here, that’s the quickest way I know to get Jonn to do exactly that.

    You wanna be an idiot and use racist language, do it elsewhere.

  28. Jonn Lilyea says:

    I think you missed my point, Ol’ Tanker, that being; if Dorner had been as highly trained as everyone claims he was, there would be a lot more dead cops. They got lucky, but they might not be next time. The thing is that if they’re going to run around dressed like infantryman these days because they think the current climate warrants it, then they had better train like infantryman – the next guy(s) they corner in a cabin might not have a history of being an incompetent boob.

    Yes, Dorner sealed his own fate, I don’t think anyone here will say otherwise (with the exception of a troll or two), but, regardless of the excuses about training time and familiarity with each other, the next guy isn’t going to give them a break and take that into account and adjust his fire accordingly.

    The LAPD and the associated PDs should learn a lesson from this and instead of patting themselves on the back for a reasonably successful outcome, they should be taking measures to make sure the next one ends as equally successful.

  29. Ex-PH2 says:

    I watched that video and asked myself “Can they even hit the broadside of a brightly lit barn?” I don’t think so. Those adrenaline-laced cops almost seem more dangerous than Dorner was.

    I said elsewhere to see Dorner taken alive, to stand trial for killing four people, but perhaps this is best. It almost seems that it’s what he wanted, how he wanted to end, but the things he did prior to this — not even being able to make off with a boat? — point to someone not dealing well with reality.

    I can’t think of a more corrupt police department than Chicago, but their code of silence thing is being trounced these days and costing the city millions.

    It’s only going to stop when they decide to clean themselves up.

  30. Hayabusa says:

    19 Ol’ Tanker

    ^What he said.

    Chris Dorner murdered two innocent civilians in Irvine, then murdered a cop in Riverside, put another one in the ICU, and shot at a couple of others. Then he went to Big Bear, took a couple hostage, carjacked some dude, shot at some game wardens, then killed a sheriff’s deputy and put another one in the ICU. Over the course of a week, he attempted to murder literally every LEO he encountered, and gave no indication that he was planning to stop shooting at cops at every opportunity. I think he rampaged quite enough, frankly. There comes a time when you have to say: “ENOUGH. This stops now, by whatever means necessary”.

  31. 2/17 Air Cav says:

    In all of the reports I’ve seen about this cabin standoff, I have yet to read that anyone fired FROM the cabin or that Dorner was known to be alive when the assault began. Did I miss that?

  32. ChopIT says:

    With a near 80% advancement to O-4 (Lieutenant Commander) this guy epitomizes the worst of the worst. Advancement from O-1 to O-2 is two years. From O-2 to O-3 is two years. From O-3 to O-4 is anywhere from five to six years. This guy had two looks from a board review of his superiors and was not deemed acceptable based on his Fitness Reports.

    That is VERY telling! The board would have looked at 5+ fitreps (all O-3 level) and based on those (plus picture, plus awards) determined this guy was a slug. I am willing to bet his fitreps from O-1 and O-2 show a pattern of getting progressively worse as he rose in rank! Too bad the Navy had to wait until he failed to select to kick him out.

    I believe Dorner wanted to die, but was too chickenshit to do it himself. This was a bit of “suicide by cop”. Not that the police wanted to take him alive…

  33. Hondo says:

    2/17 Air Cav: one account I’ve read said that a gunshot was heard inside the cabin shortly before they began pulling down the last walls (they were apparently using a “demolition vehicle” to knock down walls selectively). The cabin reportedly started burning seriously shortly thereafter.

    Here’s the link:

  34. 2/17 Air Cav says:

    @34. Thank you. That link and other articles in the LAT clarified the situation for me altogether.

  35. PALADIN says:

    He was a retread and a turd, absolutely good for fuck all.
    I wonder if the LAPD did their damn homework and checked with his superiors in the Navy to make sure his character was suited to be LE officer?
    Seems to me wherever this turd showed up, there were problems with discipline or issues with his character.

    Now got all the shitstains in society making him into a folk hero , and the usual conspiracy monkeys comin outta the wood work to sing the praises of this turd.
    How the LAPD handled the whole affair, makes the Keystone Cops look professional.
    Total amateurs.

  36. Anonymous says:

    “For most of the life of the story, the only pictures of Dorner we saw were those of him in a camouflaged Navy uniform”

    My Dad, who is retired Navy, commented during one of the recent school shootings, that every time the media showed a photo of the scumbag mass-murderer, he should be photoshopped into a full clown outfit with foofy red tufts of hair and a clown-nose, or something else humiliating and silly like that. And never refer to them by their given name, refer to them as “Pansy McLoser-Ass” or something. Deny these guys (and their would-be worshipers) the whole “bad-boy hero” thing.

  37. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    “Suicide by cop” is not recognized or gernerally accepted in the LE world.

    Much like “suicide bomber” is not recognized in many circles.

    It makes no sence anyway you dice it up!

    Typically it is the suspect that chooses place, time, and mode or manner of death in these cases.

    If he killed himself with a gun, then it is referred to as “self-inflicted gun shot wound (to the head)” or words like that.

    If a LEO shot and killed him, then it is referred to as “officer involved shooting, suspect shot and killed” and/or “threat eliminated”.

    In this case it looks like a possible “self-inflicted gun shot wound to the head” followed on by good ole’ BBQ style semi-cremation!

    As a former federal LEO, I am not wrapped around tactics, based on all the circumstances the fluidity of the time-line … BRAVO ZULU (well done) to all in the final minutes!

  38. Ol' Tanker says:

    Fen, Got a clue for you. Nothing in my post was related to the stupidity of the LA P/U shooting. It was all related to the situation in the forest and the post by John. The “panic” response by those Officers is inexcusable and I’m sure they are going to catch the hell they deserve for it.

    John, to use your phrase, you missed my point as well. Re-read my last paragraph in my earlier post. It’s a damned if you do and damned if you don’t situation. The comparison to a trained infantry squad is hardly justified when that training is neither available nor allowed. Are you really going to tell me that an infantry squad is going to do everything correct and by the book in their first and probably only tactical situation working as a group of folks who never trained together? Yeah, they made mistakes. Who hasn’t in their first firefight? Were you perfect?

    To be fair, your blog post was not the only thing I was responding to. Some of the less than insightful comments from folks after the blog were a part of it as well. They haven’t been there, weren’t there yet feel qualified to express disdain without having any idea of what the folks who were there had to work with.

  39. A_Proud_Infidel says:

    Pity that a perfectly good dwelling had to be burnt down to get that reject loser, but hey, he needed to get used to flames, he’s going to be burning for a long time.

  40. Fen says:

    Thanker: “Fen, Got a clue for you. Nothing in my post was related to the stupidity of the LA P/U shooting”

    Hey Army, you can keep your fricken clue. I wasn’t just talking about the LA P/U shooting. As such, I’ve deleted that part for you, since it gave you excuse to ignore the parts you didn’t like:

    I have a reasonable expectation that Police Officers should be able to handle their weapon safely and with proficiency.
    There are indicators of unprofessional amateurism. Like poking your buddy in the back with your barrel (hello, BASIC firearm safety training) and meandering around out in the open.

  41. Isn’t it a bit odd that everything, including the corpse, was completely destroyed by fire, but the DRIVERS LICENSE remained intact and legible?

    Are we being lied to, and if so, what would be the reason?

  42. FatCircles0311 says:

    WTF, OVER!

    What a cluster fuck of terrible. Whatever, these are the professionals allowed to have scary looking rifles. I could have sworn that the police weren’t able to conduct suppressive fire tactics(cause out in town isn’t a war zone)and frankly that’s all I saw occurring.

  43. Old Trooper says:

    @19: Well, I had heard enough from self righteous cops and politicians in the last 2 weeks to form the opinion that if they want to tell the rest of us that they are the only ones that should be allowed to have “assault weapons” and not the general public, because they are more highly trained than us mere mortals, then I expect them to perform as such with their scary black guns. I heard a lot of auto fire being done in that video and it wasn’t from Dorner. Now, if the police are willing to admit that they aren’t as highly trained as they have been telling us; then fine, say it out loud and stop acting like you are the only ones that should have scary black guns.

  44. Ol' Tanker says:

    Old Trooper. You should know that the ones calling for citizens to lose weapons are not the cops. It’s the politicians and chiefs of police. Chiefs are rarely cops, they are politicians themselves and political appointees, appointed by politicians and have to say what their masters want to maintain their job. Don’t confuse them with real cops. Being a cop is not a requirement, much like being Defense Secretary does not require prior military service. It’s a political position, not a law enforcement one, same for atty general.

    The rank and file is more in line with the Sheriff’s who came out and wrote a refusal to comply with laws that infringe on the second.

  45. MCPO NYC USN (Ret.) says:

    @ 42 … his wallet (made of leather) and other items of evidence probably protected the license. The wallet surrounded by clothing and tissue matter protected the wallet. If the license was in a leather wallet and facing torward his fat ass … there was plenty of protection!

    This is no a conspiracy, the wallet and much of its contents was probably substantially intact (along with a host of other valuable evidence).

  46. Old Tanker says:

    Just for the record, Ol’ Tanker is not me….I have never been a LEO.

  47. Old Trooper says:

    @45: Actually, one of the main sponsors of gun control legislation in the state is a cop. He sits on the committee that heard the bills being introduced. When the time came for the opposition to testify, on the main “assault weapon” ban, he, and 4 other democrats, got up and left the hearing. Plus, one of the proponents of the main bill, who testified, was a retired FBI agent that couldn’t find his ass with both hands and a road map.

    I have heard both pro and con from line cops that I know. Some have the holier than thou attitude that they think gives them special powers when they put the badge on every day, while others are just the same as the rest of us. You find that in every department, however, I think where things started to go down hill is when police officers weren’t required to live in the community they were employed by. There is definitely an “us against them” attitude that has festered under the surface because of it. There is no shared community involvement by them, anymore. I know of 2 departments in neighboring cities that are full of the most arrogant a-holes you could ever meet.

  48. NHSparky says:

    I wonder if the LAPD did their damn homework and checked with his superiors in the Navy to make sure his character was suited to be LE officer?

    Considering he was commissioned in the 2002-03 timeframe, and hired by LAPD in 2005, I’d say there wasn’t much for them to go on. Even with as many former military going into LE, particularly the LAPD, a lot of civilian organizations don’t know how to “read between the lines” of a FITREP.

  49. Old Trooper says:

    @46: I heard they found his wallet the other day in San Diego. That’s why they thought he went to Mexico.