Well! Color me shocked! (is the sarcasm filter on?)

| October 8, 2008

I have currently sitting in my outlook inbox a press release from the Obama campaign about IAVA’s scorecard. In part it reads:

CHICAGO, IL – Today, the non-partisan Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America (IAVA) issued their 2008 Congressional report card, grading both Senators Barack Obama and Joe Biden a B. (http://www.veteranreportcard.org/) The same report card gave Senator John McCain a D, making him one of only four Senators to receive a D or below. The scorecard was based on key votes affecting Iraq and Afghanistan veterans – the GI Bill, VA benefits and mental health care – while also highlighting who failed to make veterans a priority.

Putting aside all I have posted the past 2 days, and have ready to go in the future, one thing stood out. The email presser was sent by Phil Carter, Veterans Director, Obama for America. I met him at the blogexpo, and found him to be a very nice guy. One can only wonder if it is the same Phillip Carter who was a founding member of IAVA:

Phillip Carter
Phil served for nine years in the Army as a military police and civil affairs officer. After leaving active duty in 2001, Phil served in the California Army National Guard and in the Army Reserve. He served in Iraq from October 2005 to September 2006 as an adviser to the Iraqi police with the Army’s 101st Airborne Division. Phil is currently an attorney with McKenna Long & Aldridge LLP in New York City. He is a regular contributor to national publications on issues of law and national security and his blog Intel Dump recently moved to the Washington Post’s opinion section.

Well, I will save you the suspense. Unless there are 2 Phillip Carters who both blogged at Intel Dump. It’s the same one.

So let’s review:
A “non-partisan” group does a scorecard made up of votes that aren’t what they say the votes are for, then the Obama Campaign uses them to alert people they got a B and McCain got a D. Only, the guy sending the email out from the Obama campaign is a founding member of the “Non-partisan” organization that did the damn scorecard in the first place?

You must me [IAVA]ing me.

Category: Barack Obama/Joe Biden, Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, Politics

Comments (49)

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  1. thebronze says:

    I used to think that Phil Carter was a decent guy, even had some email correspondence with him about the CA ARNG. Later, I pretty much thought he was a shit-bag because of his politics. Good to know my instincts were right.

  2. Raoul Deming says:

    Operation (Un)Truth
    A Trojan Jackass for the Anti-War Movement
    By STAN GOFF

  3. DefendUSA says:

    Oh man, I get to use my favorite slang…Phil Carter, Buddy fukker extraordinaire…

  4. GI JANE says:

    Carter actually believes that Barack Hussein Obama, a human bug light for despots, terrorists, and hate spewers who loathe this country and the military, is somehow more sympathetic to veterans benefits and health care than a guy who not only served his country in war, but had to partake of those health benefits as a result of the ‘peace-loving people of North Vietnam’, who were supported by Obama’s predecessors.

    Right.

    I give Carter and his IAVA toadies an F-.

  5. AZDave says:

    So Obama finally dug up the Keating Five stuff. If that’s the best they can do, then they’re really sucking hind tit.

    Let’s see. Obama has Wright, Ayers, Rezko, Pfleger, Allison Davis, Rashid Khalid and a seemingly endless list of unsavory America haters. Birds of a feather?

  6. LT Nixon says:

    Haha, TSO got linked at Little Green Footballs, but Charles Johnson said it was Jonn who wrote it. Why you ask? Because, like Roger Clinton, TSO is a drunken embarrassment.

    TSO: LOL. Good show sir, good show!

  7. SGT Ted says:

    IAVA has always been a Democrat party astroturf organization. All one had to do is see who they had endorsed in the 2006 elections. All Democrats, all the time. I wrote about on my blog that no one looks at way back when. 🙂

    http://sgtted.blogspot.com/2006_02_01_archive.html

  8. Freedom Now says:

    I’m sure that Obama put back on his flag pin (that he once promised never to wear) as he authorized that statement.

    I give Obama an A+ in the “full of it” division. Its hard to imagine that Obama really claims that veterans are more of a priority to him than John McCain. Say what you will about McCain, but come on. Thats an outrageous lie.

    Anyway with 57 stars his flag pin Obama is more patriotic than yours any day!!!!!!!!!

  9. Dreadbeard says:

    Can you say “FEC violation”, boys and girls?

  10. Freedom Now says:

    Oops…

    Anyway with 57 stars his flag pin is more patriotic than yours any day!!!!!!!!!

    Great blog, you are linked

  11. Rurik says:

    Sounds very much like IVAW is a spin-off of VVA, Viet Nam Veterans of America. That is a name and organization whihc leaves a bad taste in the mouths of many from our genration. Remembre VVA waa a chief sponsor demandig that John Kerry be invited as a principal attendee for the anniversary of the Viet Nam Wall. From VVA’s founding they always seemed to be involved in any anti-military protest activity. So IAVA seems to be just a sock puppet.

  12. ABWF says:

    like Roger Clinton, TSO is a drunken embarrassment

    Didn’t someone on the livechat of the townhall last night say that TSO is a kilt-wearing lawyer? That’s even more out there than your run of the mill drunken embarrassment 🙂

    TSO: ok, if that is true it is hilarious. I wear a kilt ONLY when going to listen to my crazy Irish and Scottish bands (Flogging Molly or Albannach) and I am not a lawyer, just a law school graduate. I do hope to be a lawyer at some point if I can get the money up to pay for the damn Barbri courses. Either way, how was my attire and/or inebriation level the topic of discussion during the debate anyway?

  13. Jefferstory says:

    IVAW is a 501(c)(3) — is this forbidden political activity?

  14. JOHN IN VICENZA says:

    The Army Times just published this as a news story with out mentioning the partisan side of it. Thank you Gannett.

  15. Raoul says:

    [Sounds very much like IVAW is a spin-off of VVA, Viet Nam Veterans of America. That is a name and organization whihc leaves a bad taste in the mouths of many from our genration.]

    IAVA or IVAW?

    Bobby Muller was a IAVA board member.

    The IVAW absolutely IS the creation of the VVAW (Vietnam Veterans Against the War).

  16. Jeremy says:

    You have to weigh the memo based on the source. Since IAVA is anti war and pro collusion, one can only expect them to award a passing grade to like minded soulless America hating … (Well, you get the jist.)and a failing grade to anyone who is patriotic, supports the troops, believes that kicking Saddams ass off planet earth, and killing terroists is a good thing.
    Had these yard birds given McCain a D- or better, it would be cause for concern.

  17. Rurik says:

    Raoul #16,

    You are indeed correct sir. And thank you. I got my post pretty badly mangled. I meant to state that IAVA was a spin-off of VVA, much as IVAW was a spin-off of VVAW. My impression is that both IAVA and IVAW are both sock puppets for stinky feet.
    Your information that Bobby (spit!) Muller is/was an IAVA board member is just more reinforcement for my suspicions. Nothing good can come from a fundamentally compromised source.

  18. YatYas says:

    Carter, Rieckhoff and IAVA are partisan to the democrats. It’s good for them to work to improve benefits for veterans, but at what cost to the overall well being of our military forces and national defense.

  19. Vet4Obama says:

    Sorry boys, but this vet has to disagree. Putting you guys in the Shit in Iraq, Stop loss program, and bumbling the peace has done more harm to the US military than the post vietnam years. You had the President and a bunc of yellow cowards who stood behind the mamma aprons (collage deferments) when it was there turn, in charge for the last 8 years. The didn’t finish the right war, and got you boogged down in the wrong war(Iraq). If McCain was a turn friend of the military, he would have stood up against Bush in 03. Among the lessons we should have learned from vietnam, and other wars, is never to start a war you do not have too. Fight 1 war at a time. Never torture! Win the hearts and minds of the locals, otherwise, pack up an go home, because you’ll never have enough boots on the ground, and they can outlast you. McCain supported torture (water boarding) and supported the war on 03. Obama was agains both Those 2 positions override all the others.

    TSO: I will have you know that I categorically state that no one should get a collage deferment. Although collages are kinda effeminate, I find them demonstrably better than macaroni art, knitting and making ashtrays out of clay in class.

    Also, as regards “the lessons we should have learned from vietnam, and other wars, is never to start a war you do not have too”….I would also add that you should never get involved in a land war in Asia, nor should you go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line. I think Sun Tzu said that. Well, it was either him or Vizzini from The Princess Bride, one of those military geniuses.

  20. Anonymous says:

    vetforobama – I certainly hope you are including Joe Biden in your “mama apron” category.

    But then, he is a socialist, so I suppose he earned his deferments.

  21. george says:

    vetforobama – I certainly hope you are including Joe Biden in your “mama apron” category.

    But then, he is a socialist, so I suppose he earned his deferments.

  22. Freedom Now says:

    Al Qaeda could not handle a two front war and that is why they lost in Iraq.

    The leftwing and PaleoConservative narrative is hopelessly skewed against our troops. They want defeat and will not stop until they get it.

    Who is the beneficiary of this activism? AL QAEDA!!!

  23. SGT Ted says:

    And here comes the obligatory troll to tell lies about McCain and claim IAVA isn’t telling whoppers and ignore the very real success on the ground in Iraq. These guys, by supporting Democrats exclusively, are lieing to their fellow vets and America about being non-partisan. What else are they lieing about?

    Vet4Obama is also trying to use the chickenhawk slur. Then why would he vote for a socialist who was willing to sell out our troops and undermine victory in Iraq? Someone who called the offensive a failure before it had begun? The Iraqis don’t think we fought the wrong war and are grateful for their liberation. That the Obamabot doesn’t think so is telling.

  24. Diggs says:

    Vet4Obama, you forgot to mention “No Blood for OOiiiiillllll!” and the plastic turkey thing. Oh yeah, and Halliburton.
    Didn’t you get the email from Axelrod?

  25. richard wheeler says:

    TSO collage vs. college.Once again that law degree proves valuable.The bottom line.Many vets are for Obama.There is no electoral College path to victory for Mac.Barack stays cool while Mac and Sarah continue to rant and rave the margin will be approx 350-188.

    TSO: Richard. For the love of God man, can you not see I was joking? I don’t care if he spells college wrong, I was trying to go for levity here. (Plus, in a particularly humorous instance one of my troops spelled college as “collage” one time, and so it was also a bit of an inside joke.) And please, when have you seen my dispute that there are many veterans voting for Obama? I have close friends from the army that send me daily texts about how great Obama is. That is there opinion and they are entitled to it. I don’t really get why everyone has to be so damned dogmatic. I don’t choose friends and associates by the way they vote, and I don’t expect them too. As for the electoral college (collage perhaps?) prediction, sounds about right to me right now, but I don’t usually play the prognostication game very well.

  26. M-2 Gunner says:

    “Vet4Obama Says:
    October 9th, 2008 at 1:43 am

    Sorry boys, but this vet has to disagree. Putting you guys in the Shit in Iraq, Stop loss program, and bumbling the peace has done more harm to the US military than the post vietnam years.”

    “Vet4Obama” must be hallucinating.
    Are the Obamunnists now putting LSD in the water or what?

    What a crock.

    Jesse MacBeth LIVES!

    ~(Ä)~

  27. DanNY says:

    Sounds like Richard drank the kool-aid…

    Dan Maloney
    NY State Cooridnator
    Gathering of Eagles
    http://nygoe.wordpress.com/
    http://libertyboy.wordpress.com/

  28. richard wheeler says:

    TSO can you not see I know you were joking.Sounds like “The Princess Bride” a truly great movie.

    TSO: TSO is from Mars, Richard Wheeler is from….Neptune. (Now, I’ll bet you thought I was going for a closer planet, didn’t you?)

  29. Martino says:

    Inconceivable!

  30. Shane says:

    Here is a vet for McCain as opposed to a vetforobama, I did learn something observing the history of Vietnam. The press and the liberal left can beat a drum of defeat for enough years that we quit. Also, after we leave there will be hundreds of thousands of executions by the rightous victors. A socialist has no issue with murder and execution, he just wants to be the one who makes the list.

  31. richard wheeler says:

    TSO Not me.”Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”

  32. JohnCorn says:

    It’s as if Obama and every single one of his sycophants are alumni of the Joseph Goebbels Institute of Totalitarian Propagands.

  33. Freedom Now says:

    Unlike Vietnam, this time in Iraq the left wasnt able to force a defeat. They even tried to recreate the Winter Soldier smear campaign that was originally used in the Vietnam War days.

    But they failed to enable our enemies to win.

    There will not be another John Kerry plaque in Iraq like the one in Vietnam.

  34. Vet4Obama says:

    Come on guys I dont call you names because you like McCain, how about a civil debate!

    The ‘surge’ worked, not because there were more of our boots on the ground, but because the AlSader, told his Army to stop shooting, and because we are buying the locals who got tired of Al Quada. Review history, and you’ll see, only 2 ways an occupying Army can enforce calm. Win the hearts and minds with lots of money and aid, and getting out as fast as possible. 2 heavy handed crack downs (much like Sadam)

    I’m not beating the drum of defeat…. but just what does ‘victory’ in Iraq look like??? Bush and his team keep moving the goal posts.

    The Iraq government has said they want us out buy the end of next year. Bush ‘negociated’ that to extend to the end of 2010. How is that defending the guys there?? McCain, say he can see us there for 100 years. do you think that makes the locals happy? Obama’s plan is in line with what the Iraqi government wants.

    He M-2 Gunner. no I’m not on LSD. But I do live near Ft Carson, and I do see first hand the effects of the ‘war’ on our active duty brothers, and their families. The mental health problems alone are hurting the readiness of our units. These are some gun-ho guys, but they are looking more and more ragged each time they return. We do not have any reserves left we needed to fight anywhere else.

    As for sending more troops in to Afghanistan. We need to step up the humanitatian aid as well (of course where are we going to get the money now). We need to be very cautious with our boys there as well. No foreign power has been able to control that area of the world. We don’t want to end up USSR, and be forced out.

    I don’t include Bidon, because he was not ‘Jonesing’ to pick a fight in Iraq. Come on guys, what would have happend to any of us if we had pull the shit Bush did when he was in the Air National Guard?? Article 13s, time in jail, kicked up to the front lines?

    But now our problems are even bigger than the wars. The economy is in a tail spin. McCain has admitted a number of times that he does not understand economics very well. So we need a smart guy, to work with other smart guys to figure the best path out of this mess. No country in history, has been able to remain a major power, when it’s economic power fell

    TSO: BWAHAHAHAHA. You a funny man. You don’t suppose Al Sadr told his guys not to fight because of all the lead poisoning deaths going around do you? As for the rest of it….You seriously do have an awesome sense of humor.

  35. Freedom Now says:

    Obamavet,

    Its rather dubious to tie alleged support for torture to whether or not McCain supports our troops, but regardless, you are misrepresenting McCain to the point of a lie. Perhaps you are woefully misinformed and in that case you can take a rap on the knuckles and call it even.

    It was McCain who forced(!) President Bush to support the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005. This was legislation that was signed into law protecting enemy combatants from mistreatment. What has Obama done besides talk?

    The worst lie or misrepresentation is that as a man who was tortured by the North Vietnamese and has been a steadfast opponent of torture ever since… McCain never supported waterboarding. This lie stems from the fact that McCain voted against a bill in which he objected to treating CIA personnel according to U.S. Army standards. So there were many other provisions in that legislation, just like most bills. McCain did not object preventing CIA agents from waterboarding.

    This is nothing but slander. You should be ashamed of being a part of such a disreputable enterprise that slanders a patriotic American veteran.

    Take your “God Damn America” candidate and keep him. He is not the “one”.

  36. Freedom Now says:

    Your posturing on the Iraq War is subjective. We had a responsibility to fix that mess that was mismanaged for over a decade with no end in sight. Now the Iraqi people are no longer under the thumb of a dictator and his maniac sons. There is a real possibility that Iraq can become the next Germany or Japan thanks to the hard work of our troops.

    And what the hell is this quote worth about McCain not understanding economics very well? McCain’s strength may not be economics, but he sure has shown a lot of wisdom on the subject. If we had followed his lead, the subprime crisis would have never happened.

    He has been smeared as part of the problem by Obama because the Democrat accuses McCain of being fanatically in favor of deregulation. This is outrageous! McCain has been a long time supporter for more regulation of the GSEs. Since 2003 McCain has cosponsored bills calling for regulatory reform of the GSEs, while the Democrats were against it at every step and tried to cover up the problems made by their policies.

    Meanwhile, Senator Obama was racking up a record amount of money from the GSEs as the crisis was spiraling out of control.

    Although he is very inexperienced, even based on Obama’s short-term record, McCain stands as an economic genius comparatively. If McCain is naïve on economics, that would make Obama an ignorant fool. And don’t give me that crap that Obama warned us a year ago about the crisis. As he was taking over $100,000 from Fan and Freddie this crisis was blowing up. Republicans were warning about this problem since 2001. By 2007 even the staunchest deniers had to admit that the GSEs were collapsing.

    I have never seen so many smears in such a short period of time as I have seen the Democrats make in this election.

  37. Vet4Obama says:

    Hey FreedomNow…

    I agree that McCain was one of many who led the charge on the 05 bill, the problem is the 08 bill.

    Having been tortured, McCain should “”NEVER”” support any arm of the US Government that tortures. The CIA has admitted that it used(s) Waterboarding of prisonners. This technique amoung others used by the CIA have been classified as torture by human right organizations. The Bush administration, says they don’t torture, but will not say what is and is not torture. They have tried to exclude the Geneva Convention Rights from people they call enemy combantants.

    My issue with McCain, is the Military Code of Conduct sets forth a standard to be followed. It explicitly defines what can and can not be done, following the rules outlined in the Genevea Convention. This should be the minimum standard for any arm of the US Government (federal, state, local, Military, CIA, FBI) By not voting for this act, McCain, gave the CIA a free hand to continue doing what ever the HELL it wanted. That is not slander. you want to prevent it.. outlaw it explicitly so there is no mistake, no room for interpritation, no room for word smithing or parsing of IT.

    While John McCain is a war hero. that in and of itself, does not qualify him as Presidental Material. He was a classic underachiver, who got by because his father and grandfather were Admirals. He got into the Acadamy because of who his father was. Despite his low standing he received a coveted slot in flight school. His hard partying and poor flight performance (7 crashed airplanes)did not affect his flight status. After Vietnam, he received a flight command slot, even though he was physically disqualified. He got a coveted slot as a liason to Congress. Add to that, he cheated on his first wife. It appears as though he dumped her because she was disfigured after her tragic car accident. Obama is not the one, but he worked his way up the ladder.

    And your posturing on the war is subjective as well.. Iraq was contained, and not a threat to it’s neighbors. They Kurds were relatively free of control from Bagdad. Dictatorships like Sadams have a way of imploding over time. Its hard to say if the Iraqs are better off now since as of 07, there were anywhere from 400,000 to 1 million more deaths as a direct result of the war. Unknow number of civilan casualties.

    McCain (he who said the fundamentals of the eonomy are strong), has been quoted a number of times saying he does not understand economics very well. 2 of many quotes.

    “I’m going to be honest: I know a lot less about economics than I do about military and foreign policy issues. I still need to be educated,” McCain told the Wall Street Journal in late November 2005.

    I think I understand the fundamentals, I talk to people all the time on economics — it’s obviously a vital part of America’s future,” But I know there are some people who have literally immersed themselves on issues of economics, how Congress works on it, the tax code, that sort of thing. I would look for that kind of talent not in a vice president but in close advisers. They are complicated,” McCain said of economic issues, “and I freely admit I am not an economist.”
    from and interview on the Straight Talk Express Nov 10, 07.

    Ok to get to the meat of the problem with the economy now:

    Yes the democrats were the ones who pushed for the subprime loan program. Yes they took money from the guys running Fred and Fannie, But then so did the Repubs. McCain close advise was on their playroll as a consultant, and his company was until the press caught on. McCains chief economice advisor is Phil Gramm. Gramm led the fight while in the sentate, to remove all the depression era rules and regulations on the banking industry. That change allowed all this mess to happen. Had that law not been passed the real estate bubble would not have been as big, and when it popped the results would not have been as bad. Yes Clinton did sign that into law, but it passed wit > 2/3 in both houses, Biden, McCain, Dodd, amoung others coted for various versions of the bill.

    This bill allows sub prime notes to be blended with prime, then hidden from view as investment instruments.

    The risk was futher hidden, with the rules to allow mark-to-market pricing, and allowing the owners to use what ever ‘propriety’ rules they thought up to classify this paper as the sold it.

    a 100,000, yeah that is a lot when you compare it to the millions he has raised from the common people via his internet site. Common practice for a senator to send a letter

    Dems against regulation… what world are you living in.. No the Republican are the anti regulation party, and they controlled both the white house and congress… If McCain, and the Repubs, wanted it passed since 2001, it would have passed. The Fed with the World Bank (led by Wolfowitz 05-7), and IMF have worked through out the Bush administration to loosen the rules on the large multi national banks and financial institutions, so they could make even more money on the backs of the sub-prime mortgages.

    As for smears..Come on Bush was far worse in 00 and 04 against McCain, Gore, and Kerry. But now: Obama is a Muslim. Obama was born in Kenya. Palin (whose husband was/is a member an Alaskian Separtist party) say Obama’s not one uf us, and he pals around with terrorists. ect…
    Even Republican stategist Ed Rollins, says the McCain campaign has gone over the top with its latest attacks. I do give him credit for defending Obama at ralleys today.

  38. Outside Observer says:

    Vet4Obama…you are right. Bush smeared, jeered and cajoled more than the current lot. Look where it (unfortunately) got him though (problem with the US presidential system maybe?).

    I am neither Dem or Rep…but you guys need to be more selective. Hating one side (because of party predeccessors and any feelings towards them)…is a little limited. As is being a one party voter. Vote for the guy who best represents your current attitude, not the one who wears the red or blue you like.
    Don’t love the next guy because he is the polar opposite though either…to the oe you hate. Put him through the exact same examinations you would for one you have a predisposed dislike for.
    Unfortunately, most facts I have read are waylaid by the amount of personal feeling included. Bloggers are not reporters either. Get over yourselves unless (like TOS has recently done quite thoroughly)…you can succintly prove, explain or justify your point…don’t make it.
    Too many opinions, not enough facts right now.

    Personality is not politics. Substance is…
    I don’t say either candidate has it …but rhetoric and substance are two different things. Elocution is handy, oratory the same. But don’t confuse grandiose speeches with having a clue. For the rest of us.

  39. Outside Observer says:

    Getting kind of annoyed now.
    The Palin (troopergate…give the “gates” a est will you) report came out today. While fnding Palin was not guilty of innapropriate conduct (and her desire to have the trooper dismissed..while maybe personal, who knows…was actually justified!).

    Anybody reading that line? All I heard was the “she used her position inappropriately”…while not actually (the commission) recommending any charges of wrongdoing.

    From the left…I say shut up about it. Who would not? I mean…who would not?
    Politics again my friends…get over it. No point being Governor if your opinion means jack shit. Or you have no power. Why do we elect them? And (byline) it was also noted by the commission that she had every right to want the dude dismissed. Why are we worried? Would she not have been remiss as a Governor to not work towards that outcome?). Come on…fight the real fight.

    Catch her out on policy…not whether you think she is the ideal feminist. That is just plain ignorant (why…lierals, why!…i was proud oce!)
    Liberalism is such a chore!

  40. Outside Observer says:

    please excuse the missed letters (they are lazy typos…don’t mention it within response, waste of both our times…I am totally aware, not ignorant because my spelling has lacked (I have even seen that used as a Democratic insult…..go the jugular on education…that is dismal) …but i am just lazy in this case). I can see the same mistakes you guys can though. true liberals would rather teach me the correct way, not point out my mistakes…and also respect whatever leanings I may have. Read Lao Tzu for a few examples thereof…or Winnie the Pooh for same.

  41. Outside Observer says:

    thebronze (didn’t read much further)> in spite of the sound of my recent posts (not that they are critical)…Phil Carter (again from the outside) sounds like he has nothing but the best intentions…it would be tragic for you (whether you still think he is decent)…to refrain from contact on a shitbag level…stay in contact if for no other reason than to ‘know your enemy’. (but preferably…to come to joint solutions…isn’t that what they are both calling for this election? Bipartisanship? Imagine if either one gets in should this get nastier than it has become. Bi-partisan my asskies!

    That is exactly what politics needs though. Discuss things with those you may not agree with. From the outside…this is where Obama is scoring points internationally. While it may be crap…the fact he says he wants to ‘sit down and talk’ with other rogue nations wins him big votes. The refusal to talk loses support on a world stage. Republicans need to address why they are not doing the best, and why the Obama camp is raking in the international funding….watch his ads ramp up in the coming weeks.
    Ebven though his discussions are probably aimless…I is making gestures. And people see gestures. What was it that told a thousand words?

  42. Freedom Now says:

    Observer, I have a simple request. Please stay on topic. Thats all…

  43. Freedom Now says:

    Obamavet,

    Do you have any other view of Republicans besides stereotyping them?

    This regulation smear that you are pushing is soooo disingenuous.

    McCain is a strong advocate of deregulation. That doesn’t mean that he is forbidden to support regulation of entities like the GSEs, who through Congress, receive special benefits that most private organizations cannot compete with. Think about what GSE stands for. Government Sponsored Enterprise.

    Congress gives them many privileges that allow them to dominate the home mortgage industry. They are allowed to sell mortgage-backed securities with only half as much capital backing them up as would any other financial institution and they don’t have to pay certain taxes. Their advantages allow them to save billions of dollars per year. You are completely taking the facts out of context. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but you are clearly a smear merchant.

    Since there is so much evidence otherwise it is utter garbage to say that the Republicans were insincere in their efforts to reform regulatory oversight of the GSEs.

    H.R.1409: Secondary Mortgage Market Enterprises Regulatory Improvement Act – Apr 4, 2001

    H.R.2575: Secondary Mortgage Market Enterprises Regulatory Improvement Act – Jun 24, 2003

    Thank you to Rep. David Scott (D-GA), who was the only Democrat to cosponsor the bill out of 21 cosponsors. Unfortunately, this bill was not able to make it out for a vote.

    H.R.2803: Housing Finance Regulatory Restructuring Act of 2003 – Jul 21, 2003

    S.1508: Federal Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2003 – Jul 31, 2003

    John McCain was a cosponsor of this bill.

    S.190: Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005 – Jan 26, 2005

    John McCain was a cosponsor of this bill.

    H.R.1461: Federal Housing Finance Reform Act of 2005 – Apr 5, 2005

    The bill made it out of the House, but the vote was more or less along party lines with the majority of Democrats voting against it. Thank you to the only two Democratic Representatives who cared enough to vote for the bill… Sam Farr (CA) and Gene Taylor (MS). 208 Republicans and only 2 Democrats voted Aye.

    H.R.509: Providing for consideration of the bill (H.R. 1461) to reform the regulation of certain housing-related Government-sponsored enterprises, and for other purposes. – Oct 25, 2005

    Passed by the House. 220 Republicans and 0 Democrats voted Aye.

    You are a non-stop smear machine. All your personal attacks against McCain completely disgusts me…

    Unbelievable…

  44. Vet4Obama says:

    Freedom Now,

    I grew up in as WASP household, voted for Ford & Reagan, but grew so disgusted buy their policies, that I have voted mostly Democratic since.

    Degregulation smear??? Well, here in Colorado Springs, the republicans are out to deregulate almost everything, except for the government itself. Buyer Beware is their moto.. Maybe Republicans in other parts of the country are different… Where as Dems want to license and regulated most everything. Considering our Constitution was built on check and balances. I agree that we need nor regulations not less.

    Fannie and Freddie support the front line mortgage companies. They have provided the support so low income people could get into their first homes. Simmilar to what the VA did for me and many other Vets to get our first homes.

    As for the bills your site, starting from 2001. It seams as though there must have been something wrong with them since in 2002,3, GWB and the Republicans could have gotten almost any bill they wanted passed, yet they failed while they held the majority in both houses. As I recall, the biggest push to pass these bills, was not to reform Fannie and Freddie, but was more in line with the Republican’s desire to eliminate HUD. It is high subjective to say that these bills would have prevented or stopped (by 05) the housing bubble

    These bills were to regulate the GSEs, not the private companies and certainly not the CDS market. The CDS, CDO, and mark-to-market rules are the real basis for the problems in the economy.

    In 1999 the Republican led by Phil Gramm and Democrats blew it with the the passage of the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Financial Services Modernization Act of 1999. This bill was the linch pin in our problems today. Had it not been passed the mortgage crisis would have been restricted to the housing market. The Bush administation’s decision to relax loan to capital ratios, and the SEC’s failure to provide tough oversite, have combinded with the derivative markets to make this problem even worse.

    http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/09/18/credit-default-swaps/
    http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/09/22/credit-default-swaps-2/
    http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/09/24/financial-meltdown/

    I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but it appears you do not know what you are talking about.

    As for me some how smearing McCain. I used McCain’s own words when describing his knowledge on the Economy. You’ll notice I did not say he has a problem with understanding foreign affairs.

    I will again submit, that as a member of the military, we were taught that the Geneva Conventions was to be followed period. I can never condon any vet who strays form that position. I do not care if it is the CIA, FBI or dog catcher, McCain should have stood firm as a matter of principle.
    McCain finished 5th from the bottom in his class… FACT. McCain was known to be the go to guy for parties at the acadamy, and later as a JrGrade officer…Fact
    Number of crashes…Fact
    His physical condition post Vietnam…Fact
    The good old boy network in the Military that protects the sons of well known and liked high ranking officers, and some NCOs.
    McCains advisors…Fact…

    So where exaclty is it that you think I am smearing McCain.

    I’m open to the facts that both sides of the asile have problems. I choose to go with the left, since they generally are more on the side of the common man. The right seams to be more on the side of the rich and powerfull.

    Jonn wrote: Just to be clear, I get the feeling from the tone of your post that you’ve 1) never been a Republican, 2) Never been a veteran, 3) Don’t understand McCain’s position on many issues and 4) Don’t understand the economic problem. Please refrain from being a liar. I’ve let you have the run of the board, and let you spread your lies, but if you don’t stop astroturfing on this forum, your ass will be history.

  45. SGT Ted says:

    The main issue I have, ObamaVet is that IAWV isn’t a non-partisan endeavor, it is an advocacy arm of leftwing Democrats and always has been. So, your group is already lieing to me and others. What else are you lieing about? The left doesn’t give a squat about the common man and has a clear record of killing him when they get power. The left, which you have chosen to join, hates America and especially hates the US military and those who serve in it.

    Democracy Now is affiliated with Code Pink, who has advocated the murder of Officers by enlisted men. Code Pink is part of ANSWER, which is a Communist/Stalinist anti-American professional protest group. They march with signs calling for the troops to frag-murder Officers and to disobey orders. IS that how you show support for the Military? By joining groups that are aligned with those that hate our Nation and its Military?

    You show an ignorance of the GC as well as telling flat out lies about McCains position on torture. Which leads me to believe you haven’t served, or if you did it was superficial and for the college money and are just another Obot parrot.

  46. Freedom Now says:

    Obamavet,

    I busted you in what I had hoped were two honest mistakes, but your propaganda now makes it clear that they are intentional smears. Every time you just backpedal and rationalize arguments that distort the truth, twisting and turning to keep your lies alive.

    1. McCain never supported waterboarding.

    2. It is clear from public record since 2001 that the Republicans overwhelmingly supported more regulation for the GSEs, while the Democrats denied there was a problem and blocked any regulatory reform. Yet you continue to overlook/understate the Republicans long record fighting for regulation of the GSEs. While concurrently, the Democrats denied the problem existed until it was too late and the whole time blocked the necessary reform. Your memory hole is obviously partisan.

    Now there is another smear that has nothing to do with McCain. YOU NOW SMEAR ME!!!!!!!!!!!

    You said;

    As for me some how smearing McCain. I used McCain’s own words when describing his knowledge on the Economy.”

    I never denied that McCain said what you quoted. You defended yourself with a strawman argument. I criticized your lies about deregulation, not that comment. Its unfortunate that you are so comfortable misrepresenting facts.

  47. Freedom Now says:

    This shows that you are basing your rebuttals of my comments on what you want to believe I am saying, rather than what I am actually saying.